GameSalad going against the flow
pHghost
London, UKMember Posts: 2,342
The recent changes clearly demonstrate trouble at the HQ. The change of CEO and a whole new financial structure make that pretty clear.
I for one, despite the fact that I fall in the category that benefits from this change, see the move a poor rash decision, without much thought put into it.
Yes, the old method was broken, there wouldn't be a change if it was a well oiled machine. But by going in this new direction, GameSalad is going the opposite way than larger professional companies. Not that long ago, Blackmagic Design made a basic version of their color grading (and now editing) suite, DaVinci Resolve, free for users. The Foundry released a free version of their NukeX Studio compositing and postproduction tool just a couple months back. AVID announced a free version of their Media Composer editing suite. So why can these companies do it? What sets them apart? The answer is having a sound conversion strategy -- knowing how to make free users into paying users. Then, the more free users you get, the bigger the crowd to convert into paying customers.
The now discontinued free GS did still offer iOS publishing, albeit with ad support from GS. This I think was part of the stumbling block. Lots of people chose to ignore these ads and published their games anyway, which led to lost revenue for GameSalad, and also tarnished their image a bit. But should free users really be able to publish? It can be a huge asset and investment for a company to let users use their software for free to learn how to use it first, if you know that they will pay later. Also these companies like to give equal opportunities to people all round the world, no matter their background.
Adobe can get away with monthly subscriptions because their software is very well known and due to the nature of it, the learning curve for their bestseller (Photoshop) is not that huge. Of course, becoming proficient is another matter, but you can post edited photos you made to Facebook from day one. Not so with GameSalad. A brand new user, after 15 days of use, will hardly make one or two baby steps. I remember myself when I started, how I despised GS Creator at first, how confusing it seemed. I persevered and now it's almost second nature to me, because I've wrapped my head around the various concepts.
Will some current non-PRO users start paying for basic? No doubt. But what about new users? Time will tell, but personally, I probably wouldn't have because after 15 days I was still very much confused and while GameSalad's claim of coding-less app development was alluring, the learning curve still seemed harshly steep.
I still believe there could (and should) be a place for a free tier -- one that would allow people to learn to use GS Creator and fall in love with it -- but would have no, absolutely ZERO publishing options. That creates a strong pull for upgrading. Those who are lucky to have GS taught at school (most of those are probably living in the US), great for you, but for people elsewhere, especially in countries where schools are unlikely to teach GS and where $19 a month is NOT a child's pocket money this is a slap in the face.
For those who talk about the cheapness of the new pricing and how an 8-year old can afford this (you know who you are) -- shame on you. You are talking down to others from a privileged place with unabashed self-righteousness. I don't speak for myself here, I am also one of the privileged, but your ignorance is too much.
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@pHghost ..before you get hounded out of here, I'd like to just say you speak a lot of sense.
I don't think this has been handled particularly well, or enough notice given. I fear its a situation GameSalad has found itself been forced into though... out of bad previous decisions that have now forced its hand financially. I think they're just trying to find the best option for long-term survival.
I wouldn't be surprised if things change yet again, before its all done and dusted...
Yep.. the lack of free tinkering is going to be a crushing shame, the infrequent visits by old power users giving tips will disappear ? They surely have to maintain some sort of free to write and test "code" option ?
We old power users have been through way more changes than this and we're still here. You don't know what you're talking about with a statement like that...lol
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Wow.. way to get confrontational....I was kind of referring to the real old power users like Tshirt and Orbz and not recently self appointed "Gurus"
Made me laff!
Recently..lol I guess over 4 years is recent huh??? T-shirt left years ago because he wanted to do other stuff not because of Gamesalad. So you talk about two people. Did you know T-shirt? I did and actually was the first to earn the new official Guru badge so I'm all legit now...LMAO
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As someone who was here before either of those people and someone who is still here today, I can tell you that Guru has earned his name (though I personally preferred the Bacon) and that's coming from someone who has had their fair share of disagreements with him.
There's definitely an argument to be made for two tiers:
I'd support that model. I'm interested in the reasons GameSalad didn't choose to go that route. But you have to remember, if they went that route we'd be back to a yearly commitment. Otherwise, people would make their game then pay for 1 month to publish. And just a few weeks ago people were clamouring for an end to the yearly commitment. No yearly commitment AND a free version is simply not a viable option.
I also think $19 for just basic use of the software is too much, but the loss of revenue if they made it any lower would be HUGE. So I get why they've set that figure.
I think they need to do a much better job of highlighting the differences between Basic and Pro and why this really is a better deal for the majority of users who will actually publish a game.
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Who doesn't love Bacon
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Oh jesus ! lol
We are talking about an SDK here, not access to clean water or human rights, if someone has a computer and internet access and even an iPad, then it's not unreasonable to guess they might be able to find $4 or $5 a week.
You say I'm talking down to others from a privileged place, me without the Pro account ! Lol, like I say this isn't a conversation about access to clean water or food or human rights, your - misplaced - compassion for these poor impoverished SDK-less souls is just silly.
If these people don't get access to an SDK they are unlikely to die.
And where on earth have you got the idea of 'unabashed self-righteousness' from !?
There are a lot of opinions flying about with regard to these changes, not everyone is going to agree, but it's still good to discuss these things, to attempt to make this a personal issue, and even go as far as trying to shame people (even including a little finger-wagging "you know who you are", lol) is just ridiculous.
Honestly if you feel anything said was inaccurate or unfair then quote it and refute it, rather than alluding to 'those who talk' and 'you know who you are' - otherwise I only hope you were high when you posted that pointless attack on a straw man you'd erected in your head.
Team up Nestle and David Cameron and you've got a solution to that, though!
Interestingly, though, @Socks embodies the type of GameSalad user who is going to suffer the most from this change. Serious user of the software, big contributor to the community, but doesn't actually need Pro (under the old model). Now it's pay $19 for something that was free before, or stop using it. Poor @Socks really does have something to complain about.
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I love how the new world mantra is to shame hard working people by calling them Privileged. Especially across the internet where you have no idea where a person came from or how much money they might posses or not posses. They might not consider some people are frugal which is why they might have extra money. maybe they bring their lunch to work or don't eat out or buy Starbucks coffee et.. Maybe they work an extra job et.. Wh is it always about the children when they want to shame someone. And when did game making become a human right? I will call this what it is, A Shameless attempt at manipulation.
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I really like the sound of that, it would entice users to try it, get hooked or hate it and either step up or move on. If someone is totally casual they can still play their own games in creator but if they want to move up to a more professional publishing level its quick and easy. But at the same time, you'd have to pay to publish anything so it would likely put a damper on some of the often complained about 'poor quality GS games' in the Apple store.
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I'm beginning a series of video on making a small brick breaker game that can be made in a few hours to try out game making.
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I assume GameSalad is banking on the draw of the monthly plan with no commitment outweighing the draw of a free but limited product.
You also have to factor in the amount of support completely free users demand. This way every support ticket is going to be from a paying customer, outside of the free trial period at least.
One change I'd like to see is that you get 15 days of free GameSalad to try it out. That is, 15 different day that you open up the application. So if you can only work on weekends, you get 7 weekends to try it. Right now you only get 2. Seems a fair balance.
Contact me for custom work - Expert GS developer with 15 years of GS experience - Skype: armelline.support
@Armelline ...you raise a very serious issue. How are us math imbeciles going to survive without @Socks to solve all our Sin/Cos issues and bumblefoolery?
Might have to start a crowdfund to pay for his Pro account...
(disclaimer: there are lots of other helpful folk on the GS forums that may not be Pro. We appreciate all their efforts too, but sadly can't do a crowd fund for everyone. Socks is a special case though, as he does really good explanations and templates.This is not to be taken as an offence to other helpful folks)
Count me in!
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Yup. I know sin and cos, and I'm comfortable using them. But I'll open up a @Socks demo on a regular basis and go "How the f**k is he doing that?" And I'll look and it'll be simple and clever and I'll hate him a little bit for it.
Perhaps GameSalad will let us donate some of our free months of Pro gained from promotions to a big "You weren't Pro but you really helped the community" pool that can be divvied up between him and anyone else deserving.
TAKE OUR CHARITY @SOCKS, TAKE IT AND LIKE IT.
Contact me for custom work - Expert GS developer with 15 years of GS experience - Skype: armelline.support
Lol !
Us privileged, unabashed, self-righteous and ignorant forum users deserve the punishment
I also think (and have always thought) that was the best model - or some form of free to use / pay to publish.
Lol, I will chisel the secret knowledge (AAA*sin(BBB)+CCC) onto two great stone tablets and forum users can visit them in a kind of cos/sin pilgrimage.
Lol, it's always the same trick, I'm surprised I've managed to string it out this far !
See... exactly my point... he typed that like it was meant to mean something... its just gibberish... surely it needs a template to show us what it does in the real world
And it should be linked via the cookbook as an example of what can be done within the 15 day trial period. Nice idea.
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@Socks I sure hope we see you in the marketplace when it re opens !
Complete Guide to iOS Publishing {} Complete Guide to Mac Publishing
Wow, simply wow. So just because something isn't a matter of life and death, it shouldn't be considered? So all the efforts by tech companies and charities to get internet and computers to the poorest, to make better their chances and equal opportunity are misguided according to you?
You simply choose to ignore the fact that there is an imbalance in the world. All it can take is two computers in a classroom in Africa and a free to use bundle software (be it SDK or anything else) and it can change the course of someone's life.
Because of this I believe it is important to strive to have free (and widely accessible) software for learning.
My comment was aimed at statements in the main thread that were full of ignorance, it wasn't just person, thus I didn't identify anyone specific. To claim that any dissent concerning the new payment system is simply whining and that a school child can afford it is ignoring basically all of the non-Western world, where the children are usually the most vulnerable.
Straw man . . . why not quote where this has been said ?
Straw man . . . why not quote where this has been said ?
Straw man . . . I think you get the idea, you are simply conjuring up straw man arguments in your head . . . why not quote where any of these things have been said ?
Of course you have, I made the point that the weekly cost of GameSalad is relatively cheap, I suggested it was 'pocket money territory', and even specified an 8 year old (figures I looked into first) - so your silly attack is plainly aimed at me.
Straw man . . . why not quote where this has been said ?
Like I suggest above, you are conflating all sorts of things here, we are talking about the relative affordability of an SDK, you have wondered off down some epistemological cul-de-sac to so with vulnerable children.
To be honest, the original thread is several pages long. There were several people reacting in this way. By the end I finished reading it all, the picture was quite clear. So yeah, some details that were in one of your posts stuck in my memory and I mentioned them here. I didn't go back to check who exactly said it. Why? Because this isn't about you, sorry. Or me. My reaction is to the general attitude I saw in the whole long thread.
As to your straw man: you are just trying to dismiss everything based on lack of quoting what you said, but completely disregard the substance of my posts. This is nothing specifically against you, so please try to get over that and consider the arguments on their own merits.
Thank you.
The problem with free to use pay to publish is that only 1 in 11.5 people ever publish a game with gamesalad.
That's probably one of the biggest metrics used in the decision to do away with free and focus towards paid model with emphasis on learning.
I'd imagine learning from start to finish how to build and publish a game is there main focus now.
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I've already produced the first video of a series making a simple brick breaker game. I expect the series to be done next week sometime. How's that for charity?
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