State of GameSalad on 9-18-2013

CodeWizard

We've updated the roadmap a bit this week to reflect what's happening. Be sure to keep an eye on that page: http://gamesalad.com/roadmap

This week we've been really busy preparing for our office move and finishing up iOS 7 compatibility. We've run into a pretty big bug with dangling pointers that causes random crashes during scene changes. This bug doesn't manifest on iOS 6... just iOS 7. We theorize that it's some kind of change in how iOS 7 manages memory that's uncovering a long standing bug in the engine that pops up during scene changes.

The cause of this bug is proving difficult to pinpoint as it manifests randomly shortly after a scene change. We've got a decent reproduction case and are now instrumenting the engine with detailed logging code to help pinpoint the cause. This should be resolved tomorrow. Knock on wood!

That's the big story this week! We're working to get the iOS 7 / Amazon IAP and GameCircle build out to you. Good times.

Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted out.

iamcartez

Sounds good to me. Now back to GTA 5 I go.

brickamator

Cool. can tell by the short state of gamesalad your bussy

clee2005

I'm very interested in your progress (my apps are broken), and at the same time understand your position... I'm certain that you guys are stressing and working hard to figure this sh*t out.

Cheers!

mulyinc

Any eta when the update is available? After you fixed the problem I would like to know why GS ignored ios7 for months? Maybe this would help to avoid this unhappy situations in the future.

gamesfua

I'm sorry to say it but i have to agree with @mulyinc
My pro membership is two weeks from expiring and for half of this year we've had somewhat stable builds 10.2 and 10.3 (emphasis on "somewhat"). Now our games are crashing and GameSalad is remedying the situation AFTER ios 7 release? I understand things take time. I do. But for 300 bucks a year i just would like to see a stable build and ios compatibility before release- not after.
The GameSalad team does great work. I'm not ignoring that. And i love the community.
But i think its fair as a pro member to be just a little bit upset here.
That is all.
And thanks @codewizard you've been a welcome and helpful addition!

CodeWizard

I can understand the upset. We're doing our best. If all goes well we'll have the update out for you tomorrow. It's not like we've been ignoring iOS 7. But the final version of it threw us for a loop. Ah, well, them's the breaks.

Thanks for your patience while we work this out!

8BitAvrin

I have over a dozen iOS apps developed with GS, and they are all crashing randomly. Patiently waiting on this super important update....

Silkworm

Its Ok in fact pretty good if we get it tomorrow. Planned a release in sync with the new iphones and in fact removed after that "icon size" message from itunes. Still thank you admin for this message.

MSEagle2

any chance ios 7 compatibility will be applied to 10.1? I still have 2 apps that wont work with 10.3

gamesfua

AMEN! @MSEagle2!
My guess is that they may eventually get to that, but their main (and understandably so) first objective is to get a stable 10.4 version out first. So if it is a reality, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a little bit after 10.4's release.
But I would LOVE it if ios 7 compatibility could be somehow added to 10.1.
10.1 is my favorite build thus far!

LittlePhoenix

Our popular toddler app Cutie Mini Monsters has been promoted by Apple today on the new App Store kids page....What do I say to the potentially hundreds of customers who may download this app in the next two weeks and find it crashes...? X_X

I'm also patiently waiting on this super important update....
PS..I'll buy all the developers (just the programmers) a large bottle Aussie beer if you can get GS 10.4 released by tomorrow...Please...

mulyinc

Well the issue is that the same crashes starts from iOS 7 Beta 1. So its not a new issue. And for me, as a developer, it seems a bit Strange to just wait until the final release hit up and see oh the bug is not gone from itself. Anyway. All of us trust GS to be platform for our business. So please proof that you deserve our trust. And good luck for fixing the issues. I am sure now, to late, the developers working as hard as possible on the issue. If all works out and we will see tomorrow, a working, update pizza for the GS team will be sponsored

I can understand the upset. We're doing our best. If all goes well we'll have the update out for you tomorrow. It's not like we've been ignoring iOS 7. But the final version of it threw us for a loop. Ah, well, them's the breaks.

Thanks for your patience while we work this out!

floydianspiral

I wanted to just reiterate what @anatomyofdreams said in his post earlier because my Pro membership is about to be over as well. I remember posting that I went pro because of the announcement of the lua-free build that would make gs run a lot faster. Now that GS has since dropped that and are working on their lua-native (or whatever) I feel a little disillusioned with my membership. While it has been great getting nightly builds, I have been reluctant to release a game I've been working on for over a year due to ios7 coming (I knew GS would have issues), scene loading needing improvements, and just overall shoddy build releases that have introduced different bugs.

I really like GS and I know there has been lots of discussion on the forums about the direction they're heading in terms of adding new features over cleaning up the engine we've been using VS producing a genuinely polished development tool. I don't want to beat a dead horse as I think they should concentrate on the latter, but what I do want to say is I don't feel the same way I did last year where I, in hindsight, naively went pro. I was developing my game and hoping to release it in the spring of this year, but GS just hasn't produced a build I feel comfortable releasing something with. I feel like that membership might be worth something now to renew (with @codewizard on board), but I also believe I'm due for a pro extension (like what happened before) because it seemed like nothing was happening until codewizard came on board and eventually kicked things into gear...but I'm not going to pay for a whole new year when I have to wait 4 months between stable releases and last years promises ended up being reorganized/dropped.

charliehgreen

Noooo this is so frustrating
Lol I hope this is fixed asap, my game is crashing as well.

natzuur

I have a couple things to say.

We are not alone in not having iOS7 support in our games, and many devs will be releasing updates in the coming weeks and months, NOT today, regardless of not using GS. A lot of customers will understand, some won't, that's just how it goes. GS is obviously making it a priority so be patient guys.

The other thing is why are we still bringing up the lua-free engine? While the performance shown from the early alpha (key word alpha) was great, who knows how much of a headache migrating projects files would have been. Just changing one thing in the existing engine (LUA jit) a few releases back made us have to fix a bunch of logic in our projects. Now imagine changing the entire language and backend of the engine... I don't think it would have been pretty. So I feel grateful they chose the route they did, and not duped in any way.

While i'm all for pushing GS forward and holding the team accountable (see my previous posts). I think bringing up these two things are kind of moot.

Just one guys opinion.

Tokuhara

@CodeWizard
Will we someday be able to include a third party mobile social SDK like Gree, Mobage or others?

gamesfua

@natzuur all perfectly good points you're making.
But i think the feeling that @floydianspiral has, is something many others of us feel-
That we went pro with certain expectations (ie lua free, etc). But then that was altered.
There just seems to be a lot of non reliable directions, time frames, builds, etc.
The ios 7 thing was just another issue to deal with. I understand GameSalad is beta. I understand that making software like this, is not easy. And i truly believe GameSalad is working their butts off to deliver a strong product. I truly do.
But these headaches do cost us as developers. And in all honesty, whats to say 10.4 won't be buggy?
But anyways, this is probably not the place to be discussing all of this. Lets hope for the best.
I don't want these comments to be seen as attacks against GameSalad, but merely a customer voice trying to urge the product to become as ambitious as its claims.
I have nothing but respect for the GameSalad team, and i, like many others, truly value @codewizard dedication and communication.
Even when he has to deal with us complainers

ellfire

Ok, here's an odd question. (I think I already know the answer, but I'll throw it out there.) I finished up a game almost a year ago. It's been happily chugging along here and there with no more tweaks, etc. I let my GS Pro lapse etc. Now, with the iOS7 bug, it's crashing right along with everyone else. Once this is fixed, is there a way to recompile my game without needing to get my Pro membership back? It isn't making enough to justify the costs especially if I am only recompiling to fix the iOS issue. Opinions? Answers? Even though it was a hobby project, I would hate to leave a buggy game floating out there.

floydianspiral

@anatomyofdreams said what I was trying to express...I do programming as well and understand something as crazy awesome as gamesalad is impressive just for existing and I appreciate everything they are doing. @natzuur I was bringing up the lua-free just as an example as how my last year pro seemed like it didn't amount to much. Now, part of that is on me, I chose not to release certain games even though I probably could have (my big project not so much). My ios7 remark wasn't condescending as I foresaw it happening and knew any sdk would have to update, with it not really being GS' fault. I think the roadmap looks awesome, but I said that last year...however I feel that GS has been in transition this whole past year (now moving) and the end result was not as much got done as we would've liked. It's a complex issue and I have faith in codewizard as ever since he has come on things have been moved into high gear, it just sucks for people who went pro around when I did because we are faced with going pro again when we haven't really seen much improvements and now see (another!) roadmap with so many features on it. If even half of those roadmap things happen within the next year (which I'm skeptical) it will probably be worth it.

SingleSparq

Well the issue is that the same crashes starts from iOS 7 Beta 1. So its not a new issue. And for me, as a developer, it seems a bit Strange to just wait until the final release hit up and see oh the bug is not gone from itself. Anyway. All of us trust GS to be platform for our business. So please proof that you deserve our trust. And good luck for fixing the issues. I am sure now, to late, the developers working as hard as possible on the issue. If all works out and we will see tomorrow, a working, update pizza for the GS team will be sponsored

I can understand the upset. We're doing our best. If all goes well we'll have the update out for you tomorrow. It's not like we've been ignoring iOS 7. But the final version of it threw us for a loop. Ah, well, them's the breaks.

Thanks for your patience while we work this out!

Your right its not a new issue. To you. But just as some games worked fine and others have not during beta testing doesn't mean every bug in every game will be found during internal tests. Your game crashing may be for another reason than the games they tested did or did not appear until later. Unless you sent them your game to check (did you?). This is the nature of development. Patterns will be found and fixes will be made.

It may very well be that the update will fix the iOS 7 issues but I guarantee there will be those still having issues that will blame GS for. I hope those can test it on both iOS 7 and below to be sure the issue is an iOS issue or a logic bug of their own making before launching the pitchforks.

'Development is a bitch yo' - Jesse Pinkman

CodeWizard

We've found and fixed the crasher. Looks like a change in how iOS 7 handles "display links" caused this issue. So, we rewrote that code and it seems to be golden. The fix is being tested now.

If all is well, we'll be squeezing out a build for you today!

darrelf

AWESOME! Thanks for keeping us up to date @CodeWizard.

How about the long standing memory management bug - has that been addressed?

squirrel42

@codewizard Hallelujah!! We'll done, GS build servers, be prepared..

DeepBayGames

That's good news. My game was approved a month ago by Apple and was scheduled to to go live this Sunday. I will obviously be pushing that back, and am presently scrambling to redo reams of marketing material, and press releases etc. As painful as this is, it's better than having my game go out, just to be panned for random crashes. I should have realized that going live so close to the iOS 7 release, was not a wise choice. Keep us posted on the new build. Thanks.

CodeWizard

We'll be following up with a 0.10.1 build, etc. early next week.

jonmulcahy

We've found and fixed the crasher. Looks like a change in how iOS 7 handles "display links" caused this issue. So, we rewrote that code and it seems to be golden. The fix is being tested now.

If all is well, we'll be squeezing out a build for you today!

will that make it into a new nightly soon (i hope!) or will that be next week as well?

CodeWizard

It'll be in the next nightly. Next week on that front too.

gamesfua

@codewizard
A 10.1 ios 7 build?! That just made my day! Thank you!

LittlePhoenix

Hi any updates, do we have 10.4 today?
Any thing to build a stable iOS7 release with today?
A nightly....

CodeWizard

It's still being tested. I don't anticipate it until the morning, sadly.

Looking out my office and seeing everyone packing boxes for tomorrow's move is saddening. Not because we're moving, but because of the timing of this move. Nothing like a big distraction right in the middle of a high-pressure release!

Once it's ready, I'll post information on it. And we'll be on deck to fix any issues that arise.