Publish with GameSalad? (Take a survey!)

adent42adent42 Key Master, Head Chef, Executive Chef, Member, PRO Posts: 2,761

GameSalad is considering a publishing model (again?) !!!

We know for a lot of you, publishing to the app store is a headache.

IAP, Ads, signing. It's all a drag!

- Don't want to deal with signing and submissions anymore?

- Don't want to pay for an Apple Developer Account?

- Let us handle it for you?

At least that's the idea... and we want your opinion on how this might work!

Just to be clear, if we do this, this will be completely voluntary on both sides.

You wouldn't have to publish through us and we can reject apps.

It's just a new service we think we'd like to offer to help get more GameSalad games out into the world!

So, please answer a few questions on your opinion on such a service.

Thank you!

https://forms.gle/AXYGZ7QqTZZJ9mWJA

Comments

  • MelodyCatsMelodyCats Member, PRO Posts: 121
    edited December 2022

    I have a lot of time and affection for GS. Been a member since 2011, it's taught me the fundamentals of coding, enabled me to publish dozens of apps, and I've received some decent revenue from them for the better part of a decade.

    As an old timer here though, I've seen the GS team take several odd turns. Off the top of my head.... deciding to go all in as an educational tool, to the detriment of its core product... also going all in on an online creator, with the aim of sunsetting the desktop version etc.. each of these diversions haven't been small turns, they've taken GS down rabbit holes for months or even years at a time, in some cases meaning the main creator wouldn't get updated for so long, that many users left the platform altogether.

    So anyway, it seems like I'm going wildly off topic here, but when I read things like GS, thinking of getting into publishing, I sigh to myself a bit, because I think it could be yet another shiny distraction, that would be a massive undertaking, likely to be discontinued at some point, from lack of time and resources... and it would again distract from the main reason so many of us joined in the first place - for an incredibly useful, user friendly and unique tool for building games and apps.

  • adent42adent42 Key Master, Head Chef, Executive Chef, Member, PRO Posts: 2,761

    @MelodyCats thanks for keeping up with us. Hopefully we'll be able to redeem ourselves and prove out our decisions over time.

    This is more exploratory than anything. I noticed quite a few creators who had problems with signing and or let their apps lapse due to app store fees or even simple neglect. I figure if we could take on some of that burden for a fee, it would be a win-win for all.

    The simplest version may be just publishing games with ads controlled by the user for a flat fee and the full publishing program would include revenue share and marketing.

    I wanted to check our community's opinion on this, but if there's enough interest, I imagine starting simple and not take on the full suite of work a game "publisher" makes.

  • MelodyCatsMelodyCats Member, PRO Posts: 121
    edited December 2022

    Thanks @adent42

    I realise it's early days and that you're still exploring potential options - and it's cool that you're reaching out to the community for feedback also. Maybe a simple publishing setup for starters would be beneficial both for GS and its users.

    I guess my only concern - having experienced the publishing side of things with my own apps for years (even if on a very small scale) is that it would still involve a constant back and forth between the GS developers and the GS team, and thus take away a lot of time resource that could be allocated elsewhere ... and possibly not generate much income. Not to mention the app stores, forever throwing curve balls on the publishing side of things.

    That being said, I don't mean to 'armchair critique' the way GS runs its business. I'm always routing for its success. If GS thrives financially and creatively that's great for everyone - the company and its users. So despite any reservations, I've always been a fan of what you've created and hope it can keep growing and improving. If your decisions prove out over time, then in all good faith, I'll be the first to cheer them on!

  • pinkio75pinkio75 Member, PRO Posts: 1,190
    edited December 2022

    Hi; for me it is not a necessary thing; but in fact I've seen many GS users stuck here with publishing problems and maybe it wouldn't hurt to offer them this service; sure if all this shouldn't block the development of the creator or new features.

    Unfortunately i saw a lot of mistakes here, but now is time to think about the future and maybe bring new features.

    For example I'm exploring the html5 market and i see great potential there; so I'd like to have the games run better than they do now without little bugs that make them unattractive.

    Anyway after 10 years of Pro user I'm a fan of what you've created and hope it can keep growing and improving.

  • RedRoboRedRobo Member, PRO Posts: 642
    edited December 2022

    Although I understand why you're considering this I personally would not want to give up control of publishing for own apps. Totally understand though why it would be great for some people, publishing is such a pain in the ...🤬

    Just to throw my penny-worth in: My wish would be to see GameSalad concentrate 100% on desktop Creator, making sure it was solid, bug-free and only moving on to new features when that was the case.

    As for publishing. It's such a huge complex and ever changing issue. I really wish we had a dedicated area where the latest up-to-date information and advice could be found. And where we could also help each other when we get stuck, as we all do! 😫 At the moment information is spread far and wide across multiple threads.

    Would like to say though, like @pinkio75 and @MelodyCats , after 9 years I'm still a big fan of GS. I use UE5 for my main job of work yet return to GS for its beautiful simplicity. It's constraints, for me are it's strengths as it forces you to be creative. My advice would be, please if you pursue this, don't neglect your core product. Keep it simple, keep it solid, and I will continue to rave about GameSalad to friends and colleagues for years to come.

  • adriangomezadriangomez Member, PRO Posts: 406

    Although my games are not sophisticated, I only use the desktop creator when I am forced to. I love the web creator. Zoom is one feature I love. I also love that I can use it on a random machine anywhere.

  • pinkio75pinkio75 Member, PRO Posts: 1,190
    edited December 2022

    Honestly i use the desktop creator and i really love it! and yes i'd like to have the Zoom, multiple selection etc... on it like the web one.

  • adent42adent42 Key Master, Head Chef, Executive Chef, Member, PRO Posts: 2,761

    Thanks for all the feedback in thread!

    Just a look behind our thought process, I had 3 goals with this project:

    1) My personal goal with this effort stems from seeing so many great GameSalad games aging out of the store. I wanted to create a mechanism where we could help creators keep their game on the store hassle free.

    2) We get so many questions on this forum about app store policy and updates. Our team isn't nearly as good about keeping up with these things as we should. Having a few apps we're entrusted to take care of would force us to keep an eye on these things.

    3) I've also see so many signing questions, even when our signing tools were working perfectly, I thought having an outlet for creators that ran into that wall would help so many people out!

    As for everyone's comments:

    @MelodyCats critique away! I'm personally a little defensive, but professionally I alway try to take a step back and seriously consider good criticism. And your criticism is well thought out so I love it!

    @RedRobo totally understand, which is why I made sure to say this was optional. Another options is to work with @uptimistik or similar helpers who can help get your games on the store under your own account!

    Everyone; thanks for the support!

  • RedRoboRedRobo Member, PRO Posts: 642

    Having thought about this overnight and reflected on it today I have to say I feel more open about it and its potential.

    The idea of not having to worry about publishing and concentrate totally on the creative side is hugely appealing. I guess I'm 50/50 at the mo and will fill in the survey and keep a close eye on where this leads.

  • marionwoodmarionwood Member, PRO Posts: 33

    I'd be *totally* for it. Updating for the never-ending cycles of app stores, reject for random 32-bit reasons, new sorts of signing keys, difference between ABB builds and whatever, GScookbook screenshots not up to date because Apple changes their mind about how to apply for which sort of certificate on a whim...? I built the apps I did as tools and textbooks for the people I work with day in day out, and another 1,000 teachers across the world apparently their also useful, as I have 100,000 installs or so. I'm not in it to make money, but to make things easier for music learners everywhere, and to have to start again every 2-3 years just to keep stuff everyone still wants to use current... is a massive headache. Frankly I'd pay someone to compile a project to a ready-to-load package state on three platforms!

    Not to be distracting from the core of GS development, but it can't be good sense for tech support to have write me ten emails, and I still can't get the damn thing to function.

    (PS, in the parallel question - I'm still a hardcore desktop user, since it's mostly about trains, planes, or overnights in the surfing van that I ever get a good chunk of time to work on things)

  • nir3112nir3112 Member, PRO Posts: 301

    I don’t think we need this for my opinion.. we need updates, new features, bug fixing to the creator more then some platform to pay more money for something we can do for free in extra 10 min of work.

    the way between great idea to the publishing button is the problem and not after that.

    Just from the top of my head..we need REST API, auto layout, notifications, folders for actors, new keyboard behavior and more..


    I’m sorry but this is what I think..

  • marionwoodmarionwood Member, PRO Posts: 33

    ...well I'm, just going to add my two cents again, before I set off on a process that has simply never taken me less than two or three days. I realise that's because I don't do this very often, but I'm a pro user and pay my dues like everyone, never mind that new users are also trying to do this stuff.

    @MelodyCats says:

    ...still involve a constant back and forth between the GS developers and the GS team, and thus take away a lot of time resource that could be allocated elsewhere ... Not to mention the app stores, forever throwing curve balls on the publishing side of things.

    It seems to me this is exacty the point. If I write an email to tech support that they can't answer, it involves a back-and-forth already. I get 32-bit publishing errors, and eventually someone at tech support compiles the thing and does a trial submit, and it works for them. And still doesn't work for me. So all this stuff has happened, and somewhere is a working package, but I still don't have it, it's still not on the app store, I haven't paid anyone extra, and the time has still been invested. Yes: any curve ball from the stores interrupts GS core aims: for people to be able to publish apps. The team having a paid reason to get on top of this stuff seems like a great business model to me.

    @nir3112 writes:

    we can do for free in extra 10 min of work

    Exactly how is GS going to lose from this? If they charge $100-200 for ten minutes of work? and raise the profie of GS and the games that it makes? When people who would like to develop apps see a pathway from good idea to app store - why wouldn't they choose it? The path to faster development of gamesalad itself it growing the business. This seems like a no-brainer to me.

    Happy New Year everyone!

  • ArmellineArmelline Member, PRO Posts: 5,214
    edited December 2022

    I just want to know who is getting their game generated, certificate and provisioning profile set up, app signed, set up on App Store Connect, screen-shotted, description & keywords etc. inputted, IAPs set up, rating questionnaire completed, and all the other annoying little things... all in 10 minutes.

    As someone who charges to do this for people, I've not really felt strongly etiher way about this proposal. I've had clients who would 100% absolutely make use of this, but I'm happy with them paying me to do it :D However... it's ridiculous to suggest this is a 10 minute process that can be done for free. It's at least an hour of work, even when you know what you're doing and all the resources are prepped in advance (and far more if you don't) and costs $99 to even have a dev account. You might squeeze out an update in 10 minutes if you're very efficient about it, but a submission?

    That's a service worth providing.

    I'd still rather updates to the core product, though.

  • nir3112nir3112 Member, PRO Posts: 301

    me! I'm doing it in 10 min.

    but this is not my point, we are paying here a lot of money and we didn't received any big update and new features (like the one that users asked for in the past..) for more then a year, so I think that GS team needs to focus on fixing annoying bugs and add new features more then create new service for money. that is it!


    this is my opinion about that.

  • ArmellineArmelline Member, PRO Posts: 5,214

    Genuinely, how? It takes me 10 minutes just to get my certificate and provisioning profile set up.

    I do agree that the core product should be their focus, though.

  • adent42adent42 Key Master, Head Chef, Executive Chef, Member, PRO Posts: 2,761

    Since we seem to be going back and forth between:

    • It's good, but more feature work
    • More feature work.

    I think it's time to close the thread. So we can focus on more feature work. :p

This discussion has been closed.