Welp...I've hit enough walls to know...I cant make games worth a darn.

Thunder_Child

I find myself slowly growing less and less interested in game creation. Im not sure asking questions on the forums for help gets me much help anymore. I cant even make a spinning reel for slots. I cant make a planet orbit a center star. It always involves trig or some stuff that I cant get a clear answer for without gigantic strings of what I call "coding". (Floor((blah blah/256*3))((more vectortotheangle of the dangle blah blah math). The change over to a new engine may have been a little to late...im not going to ask someone to do it for me...not going to pay hundreds for an app that might make $10...

A few times I come to this conclusion and usually in the forums see more "your right its not for you" vs "good info thats usfull to me".

I thought maybe making simple slots for the iWatch woukd be fun and only recieved grief aas though I wanted to throw junk in the app store and being a gold rusher. Or it cant be done additudes. Today I ran across a website with a Swift tutorial...for hundreds of $ of course to exactly make a slots game for the iWatch. Big slap there...

For the most part it has been fun making some simple games but they arent the type that people want to play...maybe me but to spend the yearly money to GS and Apple...its not worth it anymore.

As for the forums it has been OK. Not like others I have been in where discussions get closed so often, to tight a grip by the mods in my opinion...and I realize its only mine but not enough to force change in the direction long term GS users will allow...which I believe if they did woukd be the difference...the lower the totem pole you are...the less input you have.

I will keep my publishing tutorials available for a while and by next Feb I'll probably take them offline.

Im going to finish my 15 reel slots game but wont be what I want and release it in the spare codes thread. I can only imagine some will call it "pathetically horrible terrible coding". And probably be able to be done completely with tables...another lost cause for me to do or get help. Ill also dump everything I have..(nothing I paid for)...to a shared cloud drive and for a few months and then thats gone too.

I will try Graphene when it comes out...if there is a free version or free some how for current oro subscribers...I doubt it will as its a seperate product...and I understand if it isnt.

So...to @socks @tatiang @jamie_c‌ @gingagaming‌ @CodeMonster‌ @DeepBlueApps‌ @Braydon_SFX‌ I appreciate you guys. Some I missed....and some...well....you need to take a chill pill and be more encouraging.

Going back to playing games...building a new gaming rig and rebuild The [51/50] Clan.

If any of you play PC games online and see tags [51/5Ø]Thunderchildª hit me up.

TC outta here !!!!

Braydon_SFX

Sorry to hear that Thunder. I remember you first arriving on the forums. Thanks for the mention, too. Honestly, gamesalad isnt that hard to master, you just have to put the time in and really stick to it. Sure, some things require functions, but they're not that hard once you understand how they work. As someone who hates math and is therefore terrible at it, I barely use sine and cosine. And when I do, I simply follow a prebuilt equation and alter for my needs. I don't mean that in a bad way toward you - but rather as an encouragement. If I can do it, I know you can too.

Not sure what games you play, but I play BF4 and that's about it.

Best of luck man!

Bray

Lovejoy

@Thunder_Child‌ Just took a chill pill before posting so i don't sound like I'm attacking you(at least not too bad). Here goes, its a little sad to see this post. Believe it or not, i leaned the iOS publishing process from your tutorial videos, so for that i will always be thankful for.

I was going to write more but i don't feel like getting certain people's panties in a bunch.
Best of luck to you.

BTW what PC game are you going to be playing?

Thunder_Child

@Lovejoy‌ @Braydon_SFX‌

My friend is downloading on a spare PC...BF4 I bought tonight for $4.99.

We also play Bad Company 2 and vietnam...

My primary game will be jumping back to my original roots Half Life 2 Deathmatch and going to start a dedicated server again using mani-scripts and Quake sounds...build maps again.

Will be building maps for Portal2 again also.

Bray...whats you game tags? We will be playing tomorrow evening from about 5:30-11pm CDT if your around. Rmail me at ictc3d@gmail.com and we can hit some servers. I play with another local clan WSL

Braydon_SFX

Email sent.

Meta_X

I know we don't know each other or anything, and I'm kind of new to GameSalad, but I've noticed you all over the forums, offering whatever help you can... I'm sure you will be greatly missed, and that many people are happier for your contributions! Best of luck to you!

jay2dx

Good luck dude, you've helped me a lot in the past, your tutorials and the add forum advice, glad to hear your getting into some mapping for portal! I actually stated out in game design by building counterstrike maps back in version 6! Over 10 years ago, fond memories, I keep meaning to get back into it actually,

I understand your frustration and feel the same sometimes but I just tell myself to make game that I can achieve, platform type etc.. It's going pretty well and fun so far, been making smaller games while I learn stuff for my bigger game! I'm just doing it for fun I guess and if something comes from it great!

Good luck man wish you all the best

KnightStar

@Thunder_Child said:
I find myself slowly growing less and less interested in game creation. Im not sure asking questions on the forums for help gets me much help anymore. I cant even make a spinning reel for slots. I cant make a planet orbit a center star. It always involves trig or some stuff that I cant get a clear answer for without gigantic strings of what I call "coding". (Floor((blah blah/256*3))((more vectortotheangle of the dangle blah blah math). The change over to a new engine may have been a little to late...im not going to ask someone to do it for me...not going to pay hundreds for an app that might make $10...

Dude - This isn't the first time you've written this kind of post and wanting to jump ship. And like I mentioned the last time you said you were calling it quits remains the same - making games is HARD.. GS is a an easier tool to use in making games, but the root of the point is still the same - it takes a lot of blood, sweat, and often many many tears to make things work.

I've seen a number of your posts pertaining to your slots game and it sounds pretty cool. To that end, you may have bitten off more than you can chew by attempting to build something beyond your scope and capabilities.. Nothing wrong with that, mind you, but with such a venture comes many headaches and heartaches.

Look at games like Timberman or Flappy Bird - those are examples of relatively simple games that can be very successful.

Let me give you a piece of advice - and this is coming from someone that's been in the Game Industry for over 20 years (Acitvision, THQ, and a bunch of smaller devs)..

I suggest you find a partner or two..

You've obviously been able to not only get the knack for a number of the basic elements of GS to the point where you're able to help junior folks out and publish a number of Youtube help-vids. Partner up with someone(s) that compliment your skills - individuals that might be more technically inclined yet lack creativity or art ability, etc.

No one said GameSalad was a 1-man canoe sailing out alone in a turbulent sea..

(Goodness - it's not like they have a Forum or or anything...)

-- J

BigDave

@Thunder_Child‌
don't take down tutorial videos its all heavy appreciated. the main reason I could get started so quickly here was because of the works of veterans like you.

if things get to complicated you have to become more simple.
most coders here do way to challenging things
don't forget that big junk of the mobile market is the young as in every market

simple mechanics some of them you might even consider dumb
lead to success

build a template which you can use for 1000 of small simple ideas and just blast.

do not give up, take some deep breaths and get some distance and come back with fresh energy

Lovejoy

@BigDave said:
Thunder_Child‌
don't take down tutorial videos its all heavy appreciated. the main reason I could get started so quickly here was because of the works of veterans like you.

if things get to complicated you have to become more simple.
most coders here do way to challenging things
don't forget that big junk of the mobile market is the young as in every market

simple mechanics some of them you might even consider dumb
lead to success

build a template which you can use for 1000 of small simple ideas and just blast.

do not give up, take some deep breaths and get some distance and come back with fresh energy

+1

2 months ago i challenged myself to make a game a week. By the time i had made and published my 4th game, i was knocking them out in 24 hours. Next, I ended up making 11 games all in 24-48 hours each. Don't get to into trying to make $hit complicated, as an indie dev you need to get volumes of games out there to make your name known, trust me, people will noticed and the hard work will pay off. And btw, I'm not saying to buy junk templates rip-off from shady a$$ sellers(they know/and you know who they are), make your own and you will be 100 times more profitable and happy.

tatiang

Thanks for the shout out. I'll just say it's not unusual to delve into GameSalad and suddenly find yourself trying to make a game that's way too difficult for your skill set. I've definitely been there. Sometimes I've asked for help and learned a lot from demos and advice here and sometimes I've watched videos and researched a bit (especially math concepts that I find difficult) and figured things out and sometimes I've put in way too many hours trying and trying only to completely fail and give up. It's hard work!

Anyway, if you decide to go I wish you the best of luck with gaming and game design should you continue. And if you stick around a bit, well, that's fine too.

lycettebros

Frustrations and life often get in the way of the 'game'. I sympathise with the way you feel.
Good luck with whatever you choose champ.

gingagaming

I'm sorry to hear this @jigglybean‌ and I hope it's just a rant and some short time off will help you realise your worth here. You are equally valued as much as any of the mentions above. I wish you the best in anything you choose next.

jamie_c

@Thunder_Child‌, thanks for the mention and it's been a pleasure working with here on the forums. If you feel like moving on you certainly should, but another option is to make games that you know you can handle. I know a lot of people here talk about 'pushing the envelope' and 'doing the next great thing' but if you simply enjoy making games, make something you can and enjoy the process, it doesn't always have to be 'bigger and better'.

Anyway, I'll miss your input if you're not around, but best of luck with whatever you choose to do!

Socks

@Thunder_Child said:
I find myself slowly growing less and less interested in game creation. Im not sure asking questions on the forums for help gets me much help anymore. I cant even make a spinning reel for slots. I cant make a planet orbit a center star. It always involves trig or some stuff that I cant get a clear answer for without gigantic strings of what I call "coding". (Floor((blah blah/256*3))((more vectortotheangle of the dangle blah blah math).

Stick around ! . . . . I tend to find progress tends to come in jumps, you might be stuck on one aspect of GameSalad (or game design in general) for ages, then you make a couple of breakthroughs (usually through all the various stuff posted on the forums) and once you've made this breakthrough (for example you might finally understand how vectorToAngel works and what it does) this tends to open up a whole load of new possibilities . . . . this is exactly my experience with GameSalad, my first year didn't get much beyond moving an actor around a screen bumping into objects and getting 10 points (wahhooooo, App Store N°1 here I come !) . . . but if you stick at it you make discoveries that slowly start to open it all up for you.

The trig behind spinning reels and a planet orbiting a center star is identical, a good example of how making a breakthrough in one area (some basic cos and sin) would suddenly allow you to start making planets orbiting stars and spinning reels and ferris wheels and wheel of fortune games and little bunches of buzzing flies and so on. In fact the trigonometry is so basic once you work out what it is doing and how to use it you will be surprised as how simple/basic it is (about as basic as x,y coordinates).

Just keep asking questions, it will all fall into place if you stick at it.

gamestudent

hey @Thunder_Child‌, Sorry you're discouraged. I just wanted to thank you for the video tutorials you made about itunes connect and the app store. They really helped me. Thanks, and good luck.

Thunder_Child

Thanks for the kind words from you all. Im currently restoring my Mac back to purchase condition. I was suprised I have over a thousand .gameproj files on my Mac...lol.

I think I'll wittle that down to...a dozen of my favorites. Let my finger hover over the creator.dmg download for a moment and see if it gets tired and accidentally clicks a button or not.

I've worked a lot..ALOT on my slots game/s. I do want to finish it. I guess I'll work on just it. I have MANY hours and thousands of clicks left just to make the paylines finished...that I know how to do. I coukd just limit the game to what I know. The biggest thing that kept me going was Im pretty sure its going to be a GS first of its kind. I thought it could be my first marketplace template...enter it into the monthly arcade contest.

I'll keep the tutorials up.

I already am in withdrawls from not checking the forums once an hour. Lol.

OK embargo OFF...for now...but embargo still on for any trigeogeometriacalgebrationistically...stuff.

jay2dx

@Thunder_Child‌ Please don't go! i need help with this

http://forums.gamesalad.com/discussion/75231/please-please-help-me-with-a-change-image-animation-on-rotation-rule#latest

haha anyways glad your thinking of staying mate, and yeah just stick to what you can do for now! your slots game sounds good, i play that iOS game ifruitbomb5 quite a lot so would love to see a slots game by a GS'er

SavvyPracticality

@Thunder_Child I am sure there are others on these forums, who like me, would have never gotten off the ground without your help, and the help of those you mentioned. I'm new to building games, but I would like to give a bit of advice. Don't try to eat the elephant in one bite. Set small attainable goals, and keep a record of them, so that you don't look back over all that you've done feeling like it took you no where.

I sure don't want to see you go, but I understand if you do. Maybe a breather and a change of pace for a bit is all you need? Maybe an accountability partner? I'm not new to working online, and sometimes, this be-your-own-boss thing really sucks. You spend your time reminding yourself of what you perceive as failure, and there is no one around to remind you of where you got it right. Cut yourself some slack, OK?

neoman

@Thunder_Child Take a deep breath dude and have a break then come back. I would hate to see you go but if you have to then all the best with whatever you decide to do ... Hope you stick around ...

The_Gamesalad_Guru

It took us all a while to learn GS. It took me a year of solid study and experimenting. Building demos, watching every Tshirtbooth video there was. After about a year the light bulb came on. Don't be distracted by others. This I think is like the 4th time you've quit, yet you come back so there must be some love for gamemaking in there. Make peace with the fact this is not easy and will take time, lots of time, and keep going.

As to the lower the totem pole comment. Those who were chosen for the alpha test and are asked for input are longtime GS users who have contributed to building this community you now enjoy from nothing. So when GS goes to them it's for a reason. 1.they know the community and have years of looking out for it. 2. They know the software well and most all have GS firsts as we call it, which is coding something no one had done before with GS. 3. Are the ones who have produced guides et to educate the user base. The metrics have nothing to do with popularity or such, this is a business and not some club. I think we for get this around here.

Be patient you've been here just over a year. Most of who you would say are near the top of your pole, we're just nobodies a year in as well. You can't measure yourself against people with more years of experience and think you don't somehow measure up. This isn't easy for any of us. What you don't see is us sitting behind our computers for hours and hours trying to make something work. Spending days thinking about it. Looking up concepts on the forum. The 50 failed experiments. The only difference is the relentless attitude, not the knowledge. Just remember the higher you climb the harder it gets.

imGua

@jay2dx said:
I actually stated out in game design by building counterstrike maps back in version 6! Over 10 years ago, fond memories

Me too

Thunder_Child

@The_Gamesalad_Guru‌

I did not mean to imply alpha testing the new engine was about being higher on the totem pole. Really. Id much rather people who know what they are doing be a part of that. I felt my comment was leaning more towards how the forums work. I think it can be more fun. More interactive. There are ways to bring people closer together. Im still against closing of threads at the first sign of references to places to gain knowledge outside of what GS has offered. i dont really want to continue on this...

I just hope the Graphene forums are much different in both interactivity and rules.

Still though...I know my threats to quit sound like a broken record and yet here I am still. :-)

I am going to take a small break. Make some notes on paper again for my slots game and hope to hit it hard again and finish it up. Its the one goal I have if there is any thing keeping me going. I think I will work on it finish it and polish it, insert dev notes at every point in the project and be my one template.

Maybe I can find find a co developer to finish it up...

Thanks again folks.

The_Gamesalad_Guru

I don't think Graphene will have a special forum. People are people after all. It's not the software that makes a forum.

jamie_c

@The_Gamesalad_Guru, agreed. I would expect it will get a main head in the sidebar, like "Gamesalad 101" and "Education" etc. but not it's own full forum.

Thunder_Child

@The_Gamesalad_Guru said:
I don't think Graphene will have a special forum. People are people after all. It's not the software that makes a forum.

I really hope your wrong on this. I am going to ask specifically for one...create a poll...do what ever I can...to have seperate forums.

I shall make it my quest !!!!:)

tatiang

@Thunder_Child said:
I really hope your wrong on this. I am going to ask specifically for one...create a poll...do what ever I can...to have seperate forums.

>

I shall make it my quest !!!!:)

I thought you were leaving! But seriously, can you explain why you want a separate forum that is "much different in both interactivity and rules"? The rules for this forum were created by the GS Staff with input from moderators and after careful reflection on past experiences and problems on the forums. I don't really expect another forum to have separate rules. And as far as interactivity goes, are you looking for more responses from members, social networking tools ("friend" button), a more positive attitude, ... what exactly?

Braydon_SFX

I'd actually, as of right now, prefer a separate forums for Graphene. I can see this forum getting extremely cluttered with triple the amount of threads that go unanswered. On the other-hand, Graphene seems to be a 'product' that GameSalad is releasing, so it may make sense to have the Graphene forum on the company website (gamesalad.com) along with the GameSalad product forum. Good food for thought I guess.

The_Gamesalad_Guru

I'm with @tatiang‌ on this one. This isn't high school. This isn't about being cool or popular, it's about making games and money. The community can answer questions and offer some advice but like life it's up to the individual to make their dream/business work. Other than for reasons of the content differences another forum other than a separate section makes no real sense.

As was said what's your real point @Thunder_Child‌? Let's get to the root of this.

RedRobo

@Thunder_Child‌ I think we all get thoughts exactly like the ones you are having. I sometimes wonder what the hell I am doing with my life spending so long on something that is earning me about a dollar a week max!!! But I also keep coming back to it...I think because I do feel like I'm slowly getting better and I'm sure you are too. Sometimes it's just good to have a break and go again when you feel a bit more positive. Good luck!

Socks

@strag said:
I sometimes wonder what the hell I am doing with my life spending so long on something that is earning me about a dollar a week max!!

That's about a dollar a week more than me !